From:
WOLFYSLUV@aol.com
Date: 2002-12-04 15:43:30 UTC
Subject: more on slow heart rate; unsuccessful insulinoma surgery
To: ferrethealth@smartgroups.com, julie_fossa@yahoo.com
Message-ID: <14b.1854a403.2b1f87f0@aol.com>
I have a ferret currently being treated for Helicobactor (Biaxin and
amoxy), and has signs of uclers in addition so he is getting carafate. His
condition has greatly improved, but the poor little guy is still grinding his
teeth when he tries to eat and for a time after he eats. I am having trouble
understanding the correct dosage of Carafate from the search I did in the
archives.
I gave the carafate 30 min before his morning and nightly meal of baby
chicken food (I realize this is not enough carafate). He keeps wanting
kibble too (to nibble on) so he has a bowl in there of it for when he wants
it. Even if he is trying to eat the kibble should it be taken from him?
Should I instead give him baby chicken food every four hours and only baby
food? Gosh I'd hate for him to abandon the kibble (been through a soup
addicted ferret before). But if I should, I will. As far as the carafate,
then he needs this medicine before each meal making it four times a day at
least? Is that right? Is four meals of baby food enough for a ferret if he
is eating okay? He is looking constapated now, from all the meds (or I think
its from the meds). Very stiff and bulky stools right now. So I upped his
fluids. Back to the carafate....... he is on liquid, that is 1 gm/10 ml and
dosed at 1 and 1/4 ml. He is not even a lb he has lost so much weight (but
is quickly putting it back on).
My questions are:
1) Is this the right dosage for Carfate? How many times a day do I give it
to him?
2) I know he needs a month of a bland diet, but what does this exactly
contitute? How many meals of baby food a day do I give him? Do I take the
kibbles away or not (or do I make a soupy mix of it for him in the chicken)?
Wolfy
Wolfy's site has MOVED to:
http://wolfysluv.jacksnet.com/
To: Ferret Mailing List <ferret-list@cunyvm.cuny.edu>,
FHL <ferrethealth@smartgroups.com>
From: ssiu@cgl.uwaterloo.ca
Message-ID: <Pine.SOL.4.44.0212040825230.23415-100000@mud>
I think it was well over a month ago when I posted to the fml and
fhl asking if anybody knows anything about slowed heart rate under
anaesthesia in a ferret. have learned a bit more about it since,
but was not able to write emails for a little while due to 2
ferrets crossing fairly suddenly within a week of each other.
since the condition seems rather unusual, I want to let people
know about it in case it comes up for somebody else, and so my
apologies to people who read both groups.
to refresh your memory a little, my ferret Sand was scheduled
for surgery around mid september, due to a mass in his abdomen.
under anaesthesia, his heart rate dropped to about 30, and they
decided it was too dangerous for surgery. initial thoughts
were that he is sensitive to pre-meds. he then went in for
electrocardiographs and radiographs with no premeds given,
and 40 minutes after he was under (right after they were done
with the ecg machine, of course), his heart rate dropped
although it did not go below 150. his radiographs and ecg
were completely normal. the cardiologist consulted didn't
think it was a heart problem, and we got a cardio-ultrasound
as well to rule it out completely. the cardio-ultrasound was
completely normal.
Sand's surgery was re-booked, again with no premeds, and using
sevo instead of iso, plus he was monitored with an ecg machine
so they can see the first signs of anything going wrong, and
there are other precautions taken as well. I think the surgery
was about 1-2 hours... turns out his abdomenal mass was
deflated by the fine needle aspirate they took at the time of
his ultrasound, but his left adrenal was bad and he had islet
cell tumours on his pancreas, so his surgery was not wasted..
but just before they closed him up, he started freaking out
my vet by doing crazy things. he alternated between having a
slow heart rate (bradycardia) and a rapid heart rate (tachycardia),
and had arrhythmia as well for about 25 minutes. my vet stitched
him up real fast with regular sutures, and they got a cardiologist
to look at him as well (advantages of going to a teaching
hospital, all the experts are on site). they took lots of ecg.
the cardiologist said the closest thing he can think of was
the sick sinus syndrome, which is fairly common in humans, dogs
and cats, but they have not heard of it in a ferret before.
Sand's only seems to be triggered by extreme conditions as well,
like being under anaesthesia.
Sand recovered quite well, we called him cactus boy for a while
since the vet used regular sutures for speed and those were very
prickly. I think he still has arrhythmia sometimes when he sleeps,
and I'm worried he will have to go to surgery again because of
insulinoma (he showed no signs other than being slightly less
active), and he is higher risk for surgery. the hospital just got
some external pace makers that are small enough for ferrets for
the vets to play with. I know the first thing my vet said was he
never want to do surgery on Sand again, and if he has to, he doesn't
want to do it without a pace maker. Sand is still not terribly active,
I'm hoping it isn't his insulinoma, but just a little depressed from
the loss of his friends.
here's a page I found about the sick sinus syndrome that seems
informative
http://www.naspe-patients.org/patients/heart_disorders/sick_sinus/
the short of it is that the heart nodes that generate electric
pulses to regulate the heartbeat do not work properly
I also want to mention a unusual insulinoma condition that Dief
had. he was drooling and went in for insulinoma surgery in March,
where nothing was found on his pancreas. his symptoms got a lot
worse after that, and he went in for surgery late october, where
again his pancreas looked completely healthy. sadly, he passed
away the week after, from heart failure unrelated to his surgery.
still don't have his full autopsy report, although there is some
mention there may be neoplasia in his heart. but it was odd that
he had the classic signs of insulinoma but nothing was found. my
vet has only seen it in one ferret before in his 20+ years of
exotic practice. is it common?
that's all, hope this info is useful for some.
hug your fuzzies.
// *********************************
// Selina, Sprite, Sand & Bear
// missing Birch, Dief & Storm
// http://www.cgl.uwaterloo.ca/~ssiu