Message Number: FHL1629 | New FHL Archives Search
From: Danee
Date: 2007-06-27 01:59:11 UTC
Subject: [ferrethealth] Back From the Symposium in Portland
To: "Ferret Health List" <ferrethealth@yahoogroups.com>

Hi All,
I am back from Portland. One of the wonderful things about attending
these events is getting to hear all the new ideas the vets and others
have concerning ferret ailments and care.

Bob Church gave 2 talks this year, and I think he may have shocked the
audience with some of what he said.

Bob spoke on ferret husbandry, which included feeding. He stated that
after doing his research, he has not been able to find any evidence that
eating kibble causes dental disease in ferrets the way it does in cats
and dogs. He added that he really tried to find it, too, because he had
spoken about his theories that it did in so many places.

He is not sure why it doesn't - but it may be due to the shape and small
size of the teeth. However, he wanted to get the word out - kibble does
not cause dental disease in ferrets.

That said, his research also showed that kibble does not prevent dental
disease, the way some people thought it might.

What kibble doesn't do is clean the teeth. But, if we as owners take
the time to clean our ferrets teeth, then dental disease will not be a
problem. Kibble will also cause an unnatural wear problem in the back
teeth, but this is only a problem if you want to switch older ferrets to
a natural diet. By the time a ferret is 3 or 4 years old, their back
molars, which are necessary for proper tearing of animal tissue and
cracking of bones, may be too worn to allow them to properly eat whole prey.

BTW - he said that feeding raw meaty bones may also not clean the
teeth. What he now thinks contributes to teeth cleaning is eating
feathers fur and skin. So, unless feathers and fur are involved in the
diet, he thinks you will need to brush your ferrets teeth if you want to
avoid dental disease. He was wondering if a chew toy that was covered
in fur could be made to naturally clean the teeth.

He has seen some instances of dental disease in wild animals, but the
percentage is very small as compared to domestic ferrets kept in the US.

I did ask Travis (of Prairie Wildlife Foundation) why the BFFs are fed a
raw ground meat - as was shown in a video on the web that many people
have seen. He said that basically they do not have the money or other
resources to keep prairie dog colonies at the facilities. Prairie dogs
can be difficult to trap, and it can only be done during part of the
year. Once the wild dogs are trapped, they must be quarantined for 21
days to make sure they are not carrying any diseases like plague.

Prairie dogs also take up a lot of space. A colony big enough to feed
even a few BFFs will take up not acres, but thousands of acres. So, the
dogs that are captured will not reproduce to provide more little dogs.
As a result, prairie dogs are only fed to the ferrets that will be
reintroduced into the wild.

Ferrets that will be remaining at the breeding facilities are fed a
variety of things, and do get some frozen prey animals. But, they do
also get the ground meat that was seen being fed in the video clip I
mentioned before. The ground meat is convenient, because it is compact
and takes up less storage space. It is also easy to obtain. If Prairie
Wildlife Foundation had unlimited resources, they probably would feed
only prairie dogs to the black footed ferrets, but since they have only
limited resources, they feed what they can.

There was also some discussion about whether dental disease is likely to
be a big cause of the problems we see in ferrets - during the talks and
Vet Q&A Panel, and also off-line with vets who were there. The answer
from the panel was probably not.

Dr. Susan Brown said that while it is thought that dental disease can be
related to certain types of heart disease, it is definitely not thought
to be related to cardiomyopathy, which is the main form of heart disease
that we see in ferrets.

Dr. Williams, who has looked at thousands of ferret tissue samples said
that dental disease could play a role in a small portion of organ
failures that he has seen - but that he would be talking under 5%. Most
of the samples he has received where the cause of death was liver,
kidney or other organ failure were clearly attributable to other causes.
There are some that he would classify as either unknown or uncertain
causes, and some of those could be due to dental disease.

Of course, usually when he receives tissue samples, he receives just the
organs and not the whole body. Also, he is often not told if they came
from a ferret with dental disease. If he had the whole body, or was
told the ferret had dental disease, then he might look at the samples
differently. At this time, while he admits that ferrets in the US do
get dental disease, he does not think it is a primary cause of illness
and/or organ failure.

The IFC hopes to have transcripts of the veterinary talks available
eventually, and may also either put podcasts of some of the talks on the
web, or also put audio recordings of the talks on CD's. Check the IFC
website occasionally for information on when these will be available.

In a few of the off-line conversations I had with some of the vets,
including those who support feeding a raw diet, they all stressed that
you need to be very careful when leaving a commercially prepared diet.
All of them, and Bob too, said that a good kibble is nutritionally
complete, and will promote good health (although you will have to brush
your ferrets' teeth).

They also said that if people are wanting to feed raw, they might
recommend using a raw prepared diet, like what Nature's Variety sells.

(http://www.naturesvariety.com/content.lasso?r=2046723&page=1430&-session=naturesvariety:4464D0120f48f31E43SqpqBDD2EA)
This, again, will be nutritionally complete. Many of them recommended
using prey as a supplement to a commercially prepared diet, because when
feeding prey, if you are not careful, you may not be providing all of
the trace minerals in the amounts needed to promote maximum good health.

In a private conversation outside of the sessions with several of the
vets and Bob, it was mentioned that people who try to feed homemade
diets (including prey diets) sometimes end up not feeding a balanced
diet. Several of the vets mentioned seeing things like rickets and
other diseases caused by nutritionally deficient diets when people try
to feed raw or prey, but do not manage to do it correctly.

Bob even said during his talk that all of his ferrets are fed a variety
of things including kibble. When he travels to Europe and New Zealand,
his ferrets eat primarily kibble while he is away. This is mostly for
the convenience of the person caring for his animals. He sees prey as a
good enrichment stimulant, and uses it in that way.

My own experience in feeding prey, and a number of people echoed this,
is that ferrets get very excited when given prey - even frozen and
thawed prey - to eat. Eating a commercial food, while it may be
nutritious, can be boring. When they are given prey, you can tell they
are excited. Also, eating the prey exercises the jaw, neck and shoulder
muscles more then eating kibble or another form of commercial food will.

In her talk on ferret nutrition, Dr. Brown mentioned that at least here
in the US, the smaller ferret food manufacturers have been very
responsive to the requests of the ferret community. She pointed to
Performance Foods (makers of Totally Ferret) as an example. Totally
Ferret has just announced several new foods, and one of them is chicken
free. She also pointed out that while ferrets do not need high
carbohydrate amounts in their diet, the problem is not all
carbohydrates, but the starches. Kibbles that contain no grains at all
are even better then those that do, and we do have grain free kibbles
available here in the US.

Her point was not that we should feed kibble, but that we shouldn't be
criticizing people who do. What people choose to feed should ultimately
be their choice. They should be encouraged to learn about different
methods, and their pros and cons, and should be encouraged to use a high
quality food regardless of the form. Feeding a variety of different
forms (raw, prey and commercially prepared) is probably the best from an
enrichment standpoint, though.

Finally, in her slides, Dr. Brown included some information on
nutritional values of some of the commonly fed prey items, and she
included insects. From a ferret's point of view, insects have very
little nutritional value. Ferrets have relatively small stomachs, and
so they need concentrated protein and fat sources. To get enough
protein and fat from insects would require them to consume more then
they are capable of eating. So, while commercially raised crickets and
mealworms are not harmful, she recommends using them only as a treat
item, and not ever trying to use them as a meal.

Along the same line, canned food is not very concentrated. Even if it
is high in protein, a ferret needs to eat a lot more canned food
(volume) to get the needed amount of protein. Kibble, on the other
hand, is a very concentrated form of food. As an example, she said the
kcals needed for the average ferret for a day would be found in 1/4 cup
of dry food, but would take about 3/4 cup of canned food. While she
thinks feeding canned food is fine, she recommends using it as a
supplement as for variety, and not as the main food source, because of
the volume needed.
--
Danee DeVore
International Ferret Congress Health Issues Coordinator
http://www.ferretcongress.org
ADV - If your ferret hasn't been tested, you don't know!
For more information visit: http://www.ferretadv.com
You can help fight ADV!
Visit: http://help4adv.terrabox.com/




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