From:
Sukie Crandall
Date: 2012-01-18 18:24:27 UTC
Subject: Re: [ferrethealth] Very sick ferret - advice please
To: fhl <ferrethealth@yahoogroups.com>, janicholls2002@yahoo.co.uk
Your vet is considering upper GI bleeding because of the dark green stools.
When you use Carafate for that go for the liquid prep that pharmacies carry, give it about 10 to 15 minutes before food (to allow it to settle over the wounds like a bandage), and allow a half hour between Carafate and other medications(so that it will coat them and make them inaccessible). There are certain medications with which Carafate should never be given such as Digoxin. Carafate can be a wonderful part of ulcer treatment.
In addition to the afore mentioned illnesses like salmonella, shiga toxin producing E. coli might be worth considering among the possible causes especially if kidney problems show up. (In fact, it is from the kidney problems ferrets get from shiga toxin that studies to manage that in humans evolved and you can find expert refs on that by searching on
coli ferret
in PubMed. DO use the
http://www.ferrethealth.msu.edu/
site to learn about some of the range of the GI problems ferrets get)
Ferrets DO get salmonella, and raw poultry and eggs are the most common cause though some prepared foods have had this disease in them. Usually, ferrets have quite marvelous resistance to salmonella and their people are usually at higher risk from handling the foodstuffs, but when ferrets get salmonella it is just as difficult to treat as it is in humans. Recent research has shown that the usual type of testing done by governments to see the rates of salmonella in the food stuffs is insufficient because salmonella can become inactive enough to hide when under stress.
Here are some references:
See some additional options for GI diseases here and there is a lot more at that ferret health site for you and your veterinarian who should get all of these links, please:
http://www.ferrethealth.msu.edu/Diseases/Gastrointestinal.pdf
Because some *** very incorrectly *** assume that resistance means that ferrets don't ever get salmonella types and become seriously ill I want to dispel that risky myth, and point out that every type of food choice carries its own risks and benefits so always let your vet know exactly what you are feeding, so here is a lot of info on that:
http://www.petmd.com/ferret/conditions/digestive/c_ft_salmonellosis#.TxcDXpg6Hao
http://www.petmd.com/ferret/conditions/digestive/c_ft_salmonellosis?page=2#.TxcDy5g6Hao
Note that the ability of ferrets to get salmonella has been recognized for about 70 years:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC518458/pdf/jbacter00643-0149.pdf
Note that birds and herps are reservoirs of many types of Salmonella:
http://www.anapsid.org/chomel.html
Page 341 of _Biology and Diseases of the Ferret, second edition_ (and I am greatly looking forward to the next edition even while I hugely enjoy the latest edition of the "Pink Book"):
<http://books.google.com/books?id=CSFN5H8RSaEC&pg=PA341&lpg=PA341&dq=ferret+%2Bsalmonella&source=bl&ots=Mc41wLPMY4&sig=q1NiruEYh6FC-7brhVS8W_KoNwk&hl=en&sa=X&ei=VQMXT_aJOKnm0QGUov3XAg&ved=0CFIQ6AEwBw#v=onepage&q=ferret%20%2Bsalmonella&f=false>
Page 155 of the _Five Minute Veterinary Consult_ textbook:
<http://books.google.com/books?id=rJiv3EWJTPcC&pg=PA155&lpg=PA155&dq=ferret+%2Bsalmonella&source=bl&ots=j9KmTknGsq&sig=E_GASVBnZqpkSH576DmD4EXsxyo&hl=en&sa=X&ei=1AYXT4CcKObs0gGHrZmIAw&ved=0CEMQ6AEwBTgK#v=onepage&q=ferret%20%2Bsalmonella&f=false>
I lack time to go through them but using Pubmed
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez
and searching
ferret salmonella
gets
> Results: 9
>
> 1.
> Preclinical effectiveness of a novel pulp capping material.
> Dickens SH, Flaim GM, Schumacher GE, Eichmiller FC, Schafer DR, Rutherford RB.
> J Endod. 2010 Jul;36(7):1222-5. Epub 2010 Apr 8.
> PMID: 20630303 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Free PMC Article
> Related citations
>
> 2.
> Review article: Helicobacter pylori vaccines-the current status.
> Sutton P, Lee A.
> Aliment Pharmacol Ther. 2000 Sep;14(9):1107-18. Review.
> PMID: 10971226 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Free Article
> Related citations
>
> 3.
> Treatment of inflamed ferret dental pulps with recombinant bone morphogenetic protein-7.
> Rutherford RB, Gu K.
> Eur J Oral Sci. 2000 Jun;108(3):202-6.
> PMID: 10872990 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
> Related citations
>
> 4.
> [The fever reaction of the polecat Mustela putorius x Mustela putorius furo to a bacterial pyrogen: the hypo- and hyperthermic phases].
> RomanovskiÄ AA, Karman EK, Gurin VN.
> Zh Evol Biokhim Fiziol. 1992 Nov-Dec;28(6):678-84. Russian.
> PMID: 1302417 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
> Related citations
>
> 5.
> In vitro activation of the promutagens 2-acetamidofluorene, cyclophosphamide and 7,12-dimethylbenzanthracene by constitutiveferret and rat hepatic S-9 fractions.
> Frederick KA, Babish JG.
> Toxicology. 1984 May 1;31(1):73-86.
> PMID: 6427977 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
> Related citations
>
> 6.
> Prospects for biological control of rodent populations.
> Wodzicki K.
> Bull World Health Organ. 1973;48(4):461-7.
> PMID: 4587482 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Free PMC Article
> Related citations
>
> 7.
> Salmonella infections in mink and ferrets.
> GORHAM JR, CORDY DR, QUORTRUP ER.
> Am J Vet Res. 1949 Apr;10(35):183-92. No abstract available.
> PMID: 18121314 [PubMed - OLDMEDLINE]
> Related citations
>
> 8.
> The isolation of Salmonella typhi-murium from ferrets.
> MORRIS JA, COBURN DR.
> J Bacteriol. 1948 Mar;55(3):419. No abstract available.
> PMID: 18902265 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Free Article
> Related citations
>
> 9.
> The Isolation of Salmonella typhi-murium from Ferrets.
> Morris JA, Coburn DR.
> J Bacteriol. 1948 Mar;55(3):419-20. No abstract available.
> PMID: 16561473 [PubMed] Free PMC Article
> Related citations
and searching
mustela salmonella gets 17 results so try that, too
http://ferrethealth.org/archive/FHL13697
http://ferrethealth.org/archive/FHL11983
It looks like I did not carry the study about Salmonella testing and how the bacterium can hide itself to the FHL but I see this which I sent to the FML previously and I think it contains the testing article but am running so very, very short on time that I can't check to see if it does:
> To get an idea of rates and numbers I will resort to using human figures. In a 2010 outbreak of human salmonella cases from eggs that
> 1. got bad enough that people went to the physician
> and
> 2. were bad enough that the physicians actually tested for the cause of the GI problems
> 3. and then could definitely be traced to the eggs (which means a sample of the item needed to still be around)
> http://www.cdc.gov/salmonella/enteritidis/
>> From May 1 to November 30, 2010, approximately 1,939 illnesses were reported that are likely to be associated with this outbreak.
>
>
> Things then returned to the baseline number of salmonella cases and for such figures see:
> http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/785774-overview#a0199
>
> Reported and recorded numbers all are after all those things which do not include: people who did not seek medical care, people whose physicians did not test, people who no longer had the product around (to test for the source because it was eaten or tossed already). They do not include the animals with it.
>
> http://www.cdc.gov/nczved/divisions/dfbmd/diseases/salmonella_enteritidis/
>> According to estimates from the 1990s, about one in 20,000 eggs is contaminated with SE. With approximately 65 billion eggs produced per year in the United States and 30% sent for pasteurization, an estimated 2.2 million individual eggs remain contaminated with SE.
> BUT notice that when a private study of grocery store chicken was done 22% (See Pubmed links below in this post to get those particulars.) had salmonella while the CDC page's data was created before that, so if the rate has worsened in chickens it may also now be worse in their eggs, though it may be a difference in how, where, or how often measuring was done:
>> Based on sampling at processing plants in 2007â2008, USDA-FSIS estimates that SE contaminates about one in 250 broiler chickens (USDA-FSIS communication, October 2010).
>
> Notice that it is thought that only 3% (three percent) of salmonella cases have the testing done so there is another 97% out there:
> http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/785774-overview#a0199
>> United States
>> Prevalence estimates vary secondary to inconsistent diagnosis and reporting techniques. It is estimated that only 3% of Salmonella infections are laboratory confirmed and reported to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC).[4] However, an estimated 1.4 million people in the United States are infected with nontyphoid Salmonella annually. The incidence of nontyphoid disease in the United States has been stable since 2004
>
> The stability of rates say volumes about people being more aware and more careful now.
>
> http://www.cdc.gov/features/salmonellaeggs/
> podcast for listening:
> http://www2c.cdc.gov/podcasts/player.asp?f=2775446
> link to more
> http://www.cdc.gov/salmonella/
>
> http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/785774-overview
> including
>> Reservoirs of the bacteria include humans, poultry, swine, cattle, rodents, and pets such as iguanas, tortoises, turtles, terrapins, chicks, dogs, and cats. Up to 90% of reptiles and amphibians harbor Salmonella in their gastrointestinal tracts and 6% of nontyphoid disease is related to direct contact with these animals.[5]
>
> so that answers the question of how many don't come from herps such as lizards. Since 6% of the cases come from those animals another 94% do not, but the chances of getting it from them is pretty high if someone is not careful since so many of them have it.
>
> The number of reported human cases of salmonella from eggs is despite the fact that most eggs eaten by humans are fully cooked these days, and that those who want runny eggs usually now know to buy pasteurized eggs at those grocery stores which sell them to the general public.
>
> Pasteurized eggs are also sold by the gross to some places in the food industry, though many restaurants still just use pooled regular eggs, so do not assume a place uses pasteurized eggs unless they emphasize that they do.
>
> People can pasteurize their own eggs which is possible to do with great care and using the right type of thermometer, with instructions probably online, so select a reputable site (but know that most instructions are instead for using sous vide which is very expensive).
>
> For most it is better to Google on pasteurized eggs and then use those companies' websites to find where they are sold in your area. You will find resources such as
> http://www.safeeggs.com/store-locator
> and those will probably let you get safe, runny egg yolks for your ferrets. Cool, huh? It is great to have options.
>
> I do NOT know if the whites of pasteurized eggs would pose the same biotin and thiamine deficiency problems as raw egg whites pose and don't have time to look that up, but the yolks should be fine for ferrets that way (since they are for humans and we humans get salmonella poisoning more easily than uncompromised ferrets do), and probably easier to eat, so I suspect that runny, pasteurized egg yolks might make a fine food for ferrets, including sick ones. Just expect yellow feces with a very sulphur smell from egg yolks. For runny yolks for humans and ferrets this is the best of the options, and since a best option exists, then why not use it, right?
>
> The rate of salmonella in grocery store chicken might be higher than thought previously per a study done in Pennsylvania with 22% having salmonella:
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20443729
> Efforts to subtype to better track and thus prevent salmonella infections:
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21571881
> and another important question:
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20409496
> another:
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20181876
> Some of the other relevant recent work:
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19388831
>
> Now, ferrets ARE much more resistant to salmonella than people are, so they are less likely to get it than people, and some other forms of food poisoning are much more dangerous in them, for example, shiga toxin producing E. coli which can damage their kidneys even when they survive it (See past posts and links on those.), but there certainly HAVE been ferrets who have gotten salmonella and it is incredibly hard to treat in them when they get it.
>
> http://ferrethealth.org/archive/YG9058
>
> Another vet I know feeds raw chicken BUT she gets the raw chicken from a small farm she knows and from a flock of chickens she personally inspects to be safest. If your area has some small farms and if your vet also treats poultry at any of them then your vet might be able to recommend a source that is better than grocery store chicken, though sadly not all farms use vets much.
>
> For the nutritional problems with biotin and thiamine deficiency that raw eggs can cause (though certain forms of marine fish and squid are more common causes of thiamine deficiency) see page 168 of the veterinary text, _Biology and Diseases of the Ferret, 2nd ed_). Nutrient problems pretty often are treatable IF the problem is noticed soon enough and IF the vet knows what was fed which is yet another reason to always be frank with a vet about what is fed. Not everyone is frank, and since some medical problems can mimic others in outward signs there can be confusion which is perpetuated by the client not being frank. Seeing honest with a vet about what is fed and about things ferret might have gotten into is essential for more accurate care.
Sukie (not a vet)
Recommended ferret health links:
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/ferrethealth/
http://ferrethealth.org/archive/
http://www.miamiferret.org/
http://www.ferrethealth.msu.edu/
http://www.ferretcongress.org/
http://www.trifl.org/index.shtml
http://homepage.mac.com/sukie/sukiesferretlinks.html
all ferret topics:
http://listserv.ferretmailinglist.org/archives/ferret-search.html
"All hail the procrastinators for they shall rule the world tomorrow."
(2010, Steve Crandall)
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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